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Questions, Answers, and Comments
Hello,
In reading your Web site and listening to the news of recent regarding clergy sexual abuse we are becoming aware that our family's plight is shared on a larger scale than we thought perhaps possible.
(Without reference to name(s) you may use this in whole or in part on your website or in publications).
It is sad that in organizations who call themselves "of God" we find either direct sexual abuse or "instructed" and forced ongoing exposure to such known felony crime and sin filled environments.
In my family's matter Five (5) ministers were fully aware of sexual abuse to my sister and physical abuse and beatings to everyone in the household however the ministry instructed our mother and family to not talk to anyone in or out of the church about the situation... ministry told our mom she's the Christian she needs to forgive and receive back the evildoer, (the biological father-husband).
The ministry neglected supportive and protective scriptures, 1st Corinthinas 5:10-13, "But now I have written unto you to not keep company, if any man that is called a brother be a fornicator"... Verse 13, ..."Therefore put away from among yourselves that evildoer". We find in Matthew 19:9 that fornication is grounds for divorce however due to it's own interest the ministry forced exposure to sinful criminal environments.
In earlier years ('60's-70's) the male was dominantly the money maker of the household, the male was also dominantly the physical and or sexual abuser... in order to protect the interest of the churches "tithing" income the ministry protected known male violators and sinful abusers rather than casting them out from the fellowship as the bible instructs.
Had the church followed it's biblical-ethical and legal responsibility and excommunicated the harmful abuser(s) away from our family and not instructed us to remain in that environment we then would have become a financial liability to the church, our mother didn't drive at the time and to this day she remains handicapped... so the church viewed us as a liability and chose to protect the molester and "instructed our family to be silent".
What is worse, one minister even used spiritual "scare" tactics on our mother, stating to her, "if you do not forgive and receive back the abuser you will not make it into the Kingdom of God".
There is a difference between forgiving someone and the reality that forced exposure to a violator could or would result in a relapse of sin and harms from the abuser...
...when the abuser was made known he put on an act of sorrow, the sexual abuse to my sister stopped however the abuse then shifted to me... and as time went on the abuser felt protected by the ministry thus the abuse intensified as the further reports were not followed up by the ministry.
Our mother continued to make report to the ministry both verbal and in writing of ongoing physical abuse that she was aware of, making a total of 5 reports however the ministry did not respond, failed to act, did not come to the house to investigate any of the additional reports of abuse and trauma.
After a short marital separation a minister came to the house (alone,) and told our mother that he had told the violator that he could go home. This was indeed against our mother's choice however when mom began to stand her ground and say "that's not right"
the minister aggressively stated, "I told him he can come home and he's coming home tonight, that is how it is!".
Needless to say, I/we have an issue with organizational misuse of power. Mom was doing her best to follow the bible which also instructs to follow the directions and instructions of the ministry. Then when the ministry used the scare tactics of the possibility of not making it into the Kingdom of God, well let's just say their scare tactics were effective to keep many minor children and wives in the exposure of sinful felony environments..For what?
What was the motive? MONEY, greed, position, stature, control... I wouldn't want to be them on judgement day. They avoided all moral - ethical - biblical and legal obligation to protect families and minors from further abuse and harms.
1st Peter 2:13, (an instruction to us all) "Submit yourself to every ordinance of man for the Lord's sake; whether it be to the king, as supreme; verse 14, Or unto governors, as unto them that are sent by him for the punishment of evildoers".
In our specific case Five (5) ministers over a period of "7" years of our former church affiliation protected the evildoer(s). In the '60's and '70's there was at the time and remains a "Duty to Report" law and subsections thereof... RCW 26.44.030 regarding sexual-physical-mental child abuse.
Again, I wouldn't want to be them on judgement day, the bible and mans law clearly instructs to punish and remove the violators. Certainly they in the position of church authority knew/know how to control people and if they controlled people through fear they controlled their own ministerial-financial interests.
To say the least it has been a challenge for me and several of my friends to find any normality or feeling of comfort and safety in any church environment... Pampas and controlling ministers facilitated many years of hell in my/our childhood(s), demanding ongoing exposure to known criminal-sinful serious harms environment(s).
Where do I/we go from here? Well, the bible does say to not forsake ourselves from the assembly, it also states to go out into all the world and preach-teach the gospel. So as to effect my own comfort zone I attend many church congregations/organizations, with an open ear and ready to EXPOSE any violator, abuser.
Let us all come together in the power of justice and unity to protect the little ones who are vulnerable.
It makes no difference what your title is, the law is the same for everyone, read it, RCW 26.44.030, report any abuse... If you do not Make Report to the police of such abuse at your point of knowledge of such abuse you then become an accessory to the crime(s).
Think about it, do you want that "mark" on you?
Latest News from the Institute for Biblical & Scientific Studies
9/15/01
As the World Prays, Falwell and Robertson Blame
ACLU, Gays, and Others for 'Deserved' Attack on the WTC http://christianitytoday.aol.com/ct/2001/137/52.0.html
My thoughts are similar to what I felt when a friend emailed me about Answers in Genesis claiming it was all evolution's fault - a typical response from both sources and utterly sickening!
Of course none of them point out the economic injustices that Wall Street have perpetrated in the Third World [as far as I recall God generally judged nations and peoples on how they treated the poor NOT on who they slept with or what clothes they wore - indecent social customs seems to be a symptom of immoral attitudes to the poor, in the prophetic view] , NOR do they point out the obvious parallels between the Islamic fundamentalists and their own Christian fundamentalism.
That YECism is one of the dogmas of fundamentalist Islam has passed AiG by in their cheap tirades. That belief in a PERFECT Scripture inspires people to suicidal "martyrdom" is another connection they've ignored.
I think God gave us an imperfect Scripture so we don't fall into clannish pride in OUR Scripture opposed to other peoples' strivings toward God.
Adam
Hello Dr. Meyers,
I stumbled onto your website somehow. I wasn't aware that you had one. I was looking for an online version of the creation account in Hagigah 11-14 and, though I've yet to find it, I was very pleased to stumble onto your website.
I noticed one of your articles on "The Bible and Science". While I don't believe that the Bible is a science book, it almost seems as though your article was attempting to make out the Biblical statements to be well...contradictory to science. Could you clarify, as to whether or not you believe that the Bible teaches errors about science? Sorry, I was just wondering.
John Smith
Reply:
Hello!
Thank you very much for your e-mail.
II Timothy 3:16 clearly states that the Bible is inspired by God so that it is profitable for instruction in righteousness not instruction in astronomy, geology, or biology. Much of the Bible is poetry which is not meant to be taken scientifically. For example, Isaiah 55:12 says, "the mountains and hills shall break forth before you into singing, and all the trees of the field shall clap their hands" (KJV, see also Psalm 98:8). Psalm 114:4 says, "The mountains skipped like rams, and the little hills like lambs" (KJV, see also Psalm 29:6). Should we try to make these verses into literal scientific statements? No! This is beautiful poetry.
Are there any verses that we can take scientifically? I do not think there are any verses that can be taken as modern science as Henry Morris trys to do. The Bible is a book on instruction in righteousness. The parables that Christ taught were made up stories, yet we learn righteousness from them. Even if all the stories in the Old Testament were made up, we can still learn from them. I Corinthians 10:6,11 states, "Now these things (Old Testament stories) were our examples, to the intent we should not lust after evil things, as they also lusted....All these things happened unto them for ensamples: and they were written for our admonition" These examples were not written down for scientific truth.
For fundamentalist the Bible must be scientifically and historically right, but II Timothy 3:16 does not teach this. We abuse the Bible when we try to turn certain verses into scientific statements. It is like using a poetry book for a textbook in a chemistry class. If one abuses the Bible by saying it must be literally scientific, then there are indeed many scientific errors in the Bible.
If scientific truth were so important, why did not Jesus correct the false scientific teachings of his day? It is because the teaching of righteousness is far more important than the shifting sands of scientific theories.
I plan to have a feedback page with questions and answers. Would it be all right to include your questions and comments minus any personal information (like your e-mail address)?
Sincerely,
Stephen C. Meyers, Th.D.
Dr. Meyers,
I don't mind if you include my questions or email address. I am disheartened that anyone could possibly believe that there are errors in the Bible and still claim that it could possibly be the Word of God. I myself, would simply put it on the shelf as another piece of literature if that is the case. I will still search it out, but if the Bible is not true, then I certainly am not going to believe in it no matter how much of a "good book" it is. I don't ask that anything be scientific, if the Bible was meant to be poetry then that's fine and dandy. But Jesus Christ referred to the Bible as (in the least) historically accurate. If He referred to it as such and it is not then He was lying and could not possibly have been the son of God. Certainly not a God of integrity and honesty anyway.
If you don't feel that way that's fine. But some of us actually care about truth, and when something is objectively wrong, that disproves the "objective" truth of it. It may still be "subjectively" true, but that doesn't give any motivation for believing it.
John Smith
Hello!
Whether eternal truth is clothed in parables, poetry, or pose, it is still truth. It seems that mainly America and England are so concerned with historicity of the Bible. In Europe there is no big concern about the Bible's historicity as a prerequisite for truth.
The ancient view of history is far different from the view we have of history today. Ancient historians were mainly collectors, compilers and redactors of stories. The Bible is more of a theological view of events.
There is still much debate about the historicity of the Bible today. Many archaeologists would accept the historicity of the Bible from the time of Solomon on (Maximalists). Others do not accept it until much later, after the Jewish exile (Minimalists).
The Bible is more of a theological view of events, not a historical view as we understand history today. For example, suppose I write that JFK was shot and killed by God through a human agent Oswald because of JFK's immorality. Is this history, or my theological interpretation of what happened? Can I prove this archaeologically? No! If we could prove everything by archaeology, we would not need faith. We are to live by faith, not by whether the Bible is scientifically or historically accurate.
How can I have faith when there might be errors in the Bible? God works through sinful man to bring the gospel showing his amazing grace. God could have used angels instead of man. God could have dropped the Bible out of heaven to give to Adam, but he did not. If God worked through so many sinful men and women in the Bible, God can certainly show his power, love, grace, and truth through an imperfect book that claims to give instruction in righteousness.
Sincerely,
Stephen C. Meyers, Th.D.
Dr. Meyers,
While I appreciate your efforts to "correct" my understanding of the Bible. I am that I just don't see what you're getting at. What is so much different about the alleged "eternal" truths in the Bible as compared to say, the wisdom of Confucius or the virtue of Socrates? What separates the Bible from the Koran, or the current New Age Mysticism?
Let's face it the Bible, as you have pointed out yourself, falls quite short from being valid historically, and scientifically. If that is the case, then why should I believe Jesus actually came from heaven as the Son of God? Isn't this just another theological teaching of your Christian Bible?
Just what is so good about the "moral" teachings of the Bible?
Here is a list of the grand "moral teachings" that you claim are such wonderful eternal truths (taken from an atheist website):
GE 1:28 Be fruitful and multiply. Fill the earth and subdue it. Have dominion over all living things. (Note: God appears to be totally unconcerned with population control or ecology.)
GE 3:16, CO 11:3-9, EP 5:22-24, CN 3:18, TS 2:5, PE 3:1-6 The husband is to rule over his wife. Wives are to be subject to their husbands even when the husband is disobedient to God. Man is the image and glory of God, while woman is the glory of man. Man was not created for woman but woman for man.
GE 3:16 Women should suffer pain during childbirth. (Note: This verse was used by the Church to oppose the use of anesthesia during childbirth.)
GE 4:13-15 Cain--who murdered his brother Abel--is promised protection by God.
GE 15:18 Egypt, Jordan, Saudi Arabia, Lebanon, Syria, Yemen, and part of Iraq belong to the Jews only.
GE 17:10 "This is my covenant, ...every male among you shall be circumcised." (Note: God seems to have an obsession with this--the words circumcise, circumcised, circumcising, circumcision, uncircumcised, uncircumcision, foreskin, and foreskins appear 157 times in the KJV. Although the KJV correctly translates the oldest Hebrew and Greek manuscripts, versions since the KJV attempt to soften this apparent obsession by creatively translating these words in a different fashion wherever possible.)
GE 17:14 A child is to be punished when his parents neglect to have him circumcised.
GE 27:18-24, 28:14-15 Jacob--who had cheated his brother Esau of his birthright--is given special blessings by God.
GE 31:17, GE 36:6, DT 21:15, JG 8:30, SA 5:13, KI 11:3, CH 14:3, CH 11:21, 13:21 Polygamy is condoned. (Note: David is one of the polygamists. He is an angel of God, SA 19:27, and always fulfills God's will,AC 13:22.)
GE 38:8-10 A man who refuses to impregnate his widowed sister-in-law is put to death.
EX 20:4 We are not to make likenesses of anything. (Note: This seems to preclude all photographs, paintings, statues, etc.)
EX 20:5 We are not to worship a likeness. The children to the third and fourth generation will be punished for infractions.
EX 20:8-11, 31:15-17, 34:21, 35:1-3 No work of any kind is to be done on the Sabbath, not even lighting of a fire. This commandment is permanent. Death is required for infractions. (Note: This would require even that essential services, such as hospitals, police departments, etc., shut down on the Sabbath.)
EX 20:26 You should not go up steps to a high altar; you might expose yourself. (Note: Men wore skirts at this time.)
EX 21:7-11 A father can sell a daughter into slavery to pay a debt. A daughter sold into slavery is not released at the end of six years as is an ordinary male slave.
EX 21:12 Whoever strikes a man so that he dies is to be put to death--except that, in some cases, God will appoint a place to which the offender may flee instead.
EX 21:15 Whoever strikes his father or mother is to be put to death.
EX 21:16 Whoever steals a man is to be put to death. (Note: This is in spite of the fact that a father can sell his daughter into slavery; see EX 21:7-11.)
EX 21:17, LE 20:9, DT 21:18-21 A child who curses his parent(s) is to be put to death. A stubborn and/or rebellious child is to be put to death.
EX 21:20-21 A slave owner is to be punished if he strikes his slave and the slave dies shortly thereafter. If the slave lives a day or to and then dies, the slave owner is not to be punished. A slave is the same as money to his owner.
EX 21:23-25, LE 24:17-21, DT 19:21 An eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth, etc.
EX 21:28-32 When an ox gores a man to death, the ox must be stoned. If the ox has gored a man previously, the animal's owner must also be put to death; in the case of the goring of a slave, the only requirement is that the owner of the ox must pay thirty shekels to the owner of the slave.
EX 22:16-17 An unbetrothed virgin is required to marry her seducer.
EX 22:18, DT 18:10 A witch or sorcerer is to be put to death.
EX 22:20 Anyone who sacrifices to other gods must be destroyed.
EX 22:29 Firstborn children should be sacrificed to the Lord.
LE 3:17 The eating of blood and fat are prohibited forever.
LE 10:9 Drinking strong drink in the tabernacle of the congregation will result in death.
LE 11:7, DT 14:8 Eating pork is prohibited.
LE 11:20 Eating shellfish is prohibited.
LE 12:2 A woman who has a child, especially a female child, is unclean and purification rites are required.
LE 15:2 When a man has any bodily discharge, it is unclean.
LE 15:4 Any bed that a man with a discharge lies on is unclean.
LE 15:5 Anyone who touches an unclean bed must bathe and is unclean until evening.
LE 15:6 Anyone who sits on anything that a person with a discharge sat on must wash his clothes and bathe, and is unclean until evening.
LE 15:7 Anyone who touches the skin of a person who has a discharge must wash his clothes and bathe, and is unclean until evening.
LE 15:8 Anyone who is spit upon by a person who has a discharge must wash his clothes and bathe, and is unclean until evening.
LE 15:9-10 Whatever [saddle] a person with a discharge sits on is unclean. Anyone who touches it must wash his clothes and bathe, and is unclean until evening.
LE 15:11 Anyone who is touched by a person with a discharge who has not washed his hands must wash his clothes and bathe, and is unclean until evening.
LE 15:12 Any clay or wood utensils that are touched by a person with a discharge are unclean and must be broken or washed.
LE 15:13-15 When his discharge has stopped, the person who had the discharge will count off seven days, wash his clothes and bathe. On the eight day, he must present two birds to the priest for an atonement for having had a discharge.
LE 15:16 When a man has an emission of semen, he must bathe his whole body, and he is unclean until evening.
LE 15:17 Any clothing or leather that has semen on it must be washed, and it is unclean until evening.
LE 15:18 When a man lies with a woman and there is an emission of semen, both must bathe, and they are unclean until evening.
LE 15:19 A woman who is menstruating is unclean. Anyone who touches her is unclean.
LE 15:20 Anything which a woman who is menstruating sits on or lies on is unclean.
LE 15:21 Anyone who touches the bed of a woman who is menstruating must wash his clothes and bathe, and is unclean until evening.
LE 15:22 Anyone who touches anything which was sat upon by a woman who is menstruating must wash his clothes and bathe, and is unclean until evening.
LE 15:24 If a man lies with a woman who is menstruating and any of her discharge touches him, he is unclean for seven days. Any bed he lies on is also unclean.
LE 15:28 After her flow stops, a woman who was menstruating must count off seven days before she is considered clean again. On the eighth day, she must present two birds to the priest for an atonement for having had a menstrual discharge.
LE 19:13 Hired help must be paid every day.
LE 19:19 Cattle must not be allowed to breed with a different kind.
LE 19:19 A field must not be sown with more than one kind of seed.
LE 19:19 A cloth garment made of two kinds of material must not be worn.
LE 19:26 Flesh with blood in it must not be eaten.
LE 19:27 The hair on the temples should not be rounded off.
LE 19:27 The edges of a beard should not be clipped.
LE 19:28 Tattoos and the like are prohibited.
LE 19:29 Do not make your daughter a prostitute.
LE 19:31 Do not consult mediums or wizards.
LE 20:10-12, DT 22:22 Adulterers (in some cases) must be put to death.
LE 20:13 Practicing male homosexuals are to be put to death. (Note: Female homosexuality is not considered in the OT though it NT. See RO 1:26-32.)
LE 20:14 If a man has sexual relations with both his wife and his mother-in-law, all three of them must be put to death.
LE 20:15-16 If a person engages in sex with an animal, both the animal and the person must be put to death.
LE 20:18 If a man has sex relations with a woman who is menstruating, both shall be excommunicated from their people.
LE 20:27 A medium or wizard is to be put to death.
LE 21:9 If a priest's daughter becomes a prostitute, she is to be burnt with fire.
LE 21:14 A priest (or descendant of Aaron) must not marry a widow, a divorced woman, a woman who has been defiled, or a harlot, but only a virgin.
LE 21:17-23 A priest (or descendant of Aaron) with crushed testicles (or almost any other physical deformity) is not to be allowed near the sanctuary.
LE 24:16 Whoever blasphemes the name of the Lord must be put to death.
LE 25:44-46, DT 15:17, EP 6:5, CN 3:22, TS 2:9, PE 2:18 Slavery is an everlasting institution. Slaves are to obey their masters in everything.
LE 27:3-7 Males are more valuable than females.
LE 27:29 Human sacrifice is condoned.
LE 27:30-32 A tithe, a tenth of everything, is to be given to the Lord.
NU 3:10 An unauthorized person who acts as a priest must be put to death.
NU 5:2-3 Anyone who has a discharge or who has touched a corpse is unclean.
NU 5:12-31 A woman suspected or accused of adultery is to be tested by making her drink the "water of bitterness," or holy water mixed with dust from the floor. (Note: There is no such test for men.)
NU 19:16 Whoever touches one who is slain in the field with a sword, or a dead body, or a bone of a man, or a grave, is unclean for seven days. (Note: Isn't one who is slain in the open field with a sword also a dead body? Why the distinction between the two?)
NU 19:22 Whatever an unclean person touches is also unclean. Anyone who touches an unclean thing also becomes unclean.
NU 31:18, 35, JG 21:12 Young virgins are considered a spoil of war and can be taken for the use of the victors.
DT 4:19 Be careful when you look at the stars and planets not to be enticed into worshipping them.
DT 13:2-5 Anyone who causes someone to turn to another god must be put to death.
DT 13:6-10 A man is required to slay his friends and members of his own family who are guilty of worshipping another god.
DT 15:1-3 Every seven years, a brother (meaning a fellow Israelite) should be released from his debt. Only a foreigner should be required, again, to honor his debt.
DT 17:12 A man who shows contempt for a judge or priest must be put to death.
DT 18:20-22, EZ 14:9 If a prophet's words do not come true, he is a false prophet and must be put to death. This is true even if he has been deceived by God himself.
DT 22:5 One must not wear the clothing of the opposite sex.
DT 22:6-7 If you want to live a long time, you must not take a mother bird from her young, but you may take the young from the mother.
DT 22:10 You must not plow with an ox and an ass together.
DT 22:13-21 A bride in whom "the tokens of virginity" are not found is to be put to death. (Note: The bridegroom who falsely accuses his bride gets off with a fine.)
DT 22:23-24 A betrothed virgin who is seduced in the city is to be put to death unless she cries for help.
DT 22:28-29 A virgin who is raped must marry her rapist (if they are "found").
DT 23:1 A man whose testicles are crushed or whose "male member" is cut off may not enter the sanctuary.
DT 23:2 A bastard--and his offspring to the tenth generation--are to be punished for his illegitimacy and cannot enter a congregation of the Lord.
DT 23:10 A man who has a seminal emission during the night is unclean and must go through a purification process.
DT 23:12-14 The Lord must not be allowed to see human excrement (it is indecent).
DT 23:19-20 Money must not be lent at interest to a brother (meaning a fellow Israelite). Interest can only be collected from foreigners.
DT 24:1-4 A man may divorce his wife simply because she displeases him.
DT 25:5-10 A man has an obligation to produce a child for his widowed sister-in-law.
DT 25:11 A wife who grabs her husband's opponent by his "private parts" must have her hand cut off and is to be shown no pity.
JG 21:21 The Benjamites are commanded to take wives by hiding in the vineyards and then seizing the "daughters of Shiloh" as they come out to dance.
1KI 5:13, 9:3, 15 Forced labor is apparently sanctioned inasmuch as the Lord consecrated the house that Solomon built for the Lord using forced labor.
PR 13:24, 22:15, 23:13 Children are to be disciplined with the rod-- if beaten with a rod, they will not die. (Note: Many Christian parents have inadvertently beaten a child to death following this precept.)
PR 26:4 Do not answer a fool. To do so makes you foolish too.
PR 26:5 Answer a fool. If you don't, he will think himself wise.
PR 31:10-31 The able wife is to bring only profit and no loss, rise before dawn, buy land prudently, plant a vineyard with her earnings, keep her lamp burning all night, gird herself to work, be generous to the poor, lend a hand to the forlorn, talk shrewd sense, offer kindly counsel, and never be idle.
IS 56:4 Eunuches who keep the Lord's Sabbath will receive special rewards.
HO 4:14 The sins of female prostitutes and adulterers can be excused when the men themselves set a bad example.
MT 5:22 Do not get angry. Anger is a sin.
MT 23:9 Do not call any man on earth "father."
MT 5:18-19 The OT law is to remain in effect until heaven and earth pass away.
MT 5:28 Whoever looks upon a woman lustfully commits adultery in his heart. (Note: This precept could cause some to think that they might as well commit adultery as to do so only in the heart.)
MT 5:29-30, 18:8-9, MK 9:43-47 If your eye causes you to sin, pluck it out. If your hand causes you to sin, cut it off. (Note: Many believers insist that this admonition, and others like it, are to be taken figuratively, although others take even this admonition literally. The problem is that there is no clear and decisive method to determine whether a passage is meant to be taken literally or figuratively. God could have foreseen this problem and should have provided an unambiguous solution.)
MT 5:33-37 Make no vows or oaths. They arise from evil (or the Devil).
MT 5:38-44 Turn the other cheek. Love your enemies. Do good to those that hate you.
MT 5:40 If any man would sue you and take your coat, give him your cloak also.
MT 5:42, LK 6:30, 35 Give to everyone who asks. Lend to everyone who wants to borrow.
MT 5:48 Be perfect.
MT 6:6 Pray in private.
MT 6:25-34, LK 12:22-31 Take no thought for tomorrow. God will take care of you.
MT 7:7-8, LK 11:9-10 Ask and it will be given. Seek and you will find. Everyone who asks, receives.
MT 19:12, RO 8:13 Men should consider castration, thereby making themselves eunuches, for the sake of the kingdom of heaven. If you live after the flesh, you shall die, but if you put to death the deeds of the body, you shall live. (Note: During the dark and middle ages, saints castrated themselves by the thousands in order to become more godly. Even now, the practice continues in some sects.)
MT 22:37, MK 12:30, LK 10:27 Love God with all your heart, all your soul, all your mind, and all your strength. (This is, of course, an impossibility.)
MT 23:3 Practice and observe everything the Pharisees and scribes teach.
MK 10:2-12, LK 16:18 Divorce is wrong, and to remarry is to commit adultery.
MK 10:29, LK 18:29 A man who leaves his house, wife, brothers, parents, or children for the sake of the kingdom of God will receive special rewards.
LK 12:33, TI 6:8 Sell your possessions and give to charity. Be content with having only food and clothing. (Note: Many believers claim that the first injunction applies only to those who are wealthy or have a problem with wealth. That this is not the case is clear from the context. It is also clear that the Disciples practiced this principle; see AC 2:44-45 and 4:32-35. This is in sharp contrast to the concept of abundance that many evangelists preach and to the personal wealth they often amass.)
LK 14:26 One cannot be a disciple of Jesus unless he hates his mother, father, wife, children, brothers, sisters, and even his own life.
LK 14:33 "... any of you who does not give up everything he has cannot be my disciple."
LK 18:1, 1TH 5:17 Pray constantly. Don't give up.
RO 1:26-27, 32 Men and women who commit unnatural sexual acts deserve to die.
RO 13:1-4, PE 2:13-14 Be subject to every human institution. All authorities (laws and governments) are from God. (Note: This would include those of a Nazi Germany, yet believers seldom follow this injunction. Even Jesus and his Disciples violated this principle.)
1CO 3:18 Become a "fool" (for Christ) in order to become wise. (Note: A fool is still a fool.)
1CO 6:1-8 Christians should never go to court against each other, but should, instead, let the church settle their differences.
1CO 7:1-38 Men and widows should not marry. Although it is well for a man to remain chaste, the temptation to immorality is a valid reason to marry; a man should marry if he cannot control himself. Yet, a man who is already married should live as if he were not. He that is unmarried is concerned about how he can please the Lord while he that is married is concerned about pleasing his spouse. It is better to remain single so as to attend to the Lord without distraction.
1CO 10:24 Put your neighbor's good ahead of your own.
1CO 11:3-10 A woman is to keep her head covered while praying or prophesying.
1CO 11:14 It is a shame for a man to have long hair. (Note: Why is it, then, that most portrayals of Jesus show him with long hair?)
1CO 14:34-35 Women are to be silent in church. If they have any questions, they are to ask their husbands at home. It is a shame for women to speak in church.
2CO 13:12 Greet each other with a holy kiss.
CN 2:8 Philosophy is to be shunned.
1TH 5:16 Rejoice always.
1TH 5:18 Give thanks no matter what the circumstances.
2TH 3:10 Anyone who doesn't work should not be allowed to eat.
1TI 2:9, 1PE 3:3 Women should not braid their hair, or wear gold or pearls or costly attire.
1TI 2:11-12 Women are to learn in silence (from men) in all submissiveness.
1TI 2:12 Women are not permitted to teach or have authority over men.
TS 1:10-11 There are many who must be silenced.
JA 4:7-10 Humble yourselves before God: be miserable, grieve and cry, let laughter be turned to sorrow. The Lord will then exalt you.
JA 5:14-15 Use prayer and anointing to cure illness.
1 JN 1:9-11 Do not allow anyone into your house who is not a fellow believer.
God must have really been a poor source of inspiration for these "moral" teachings. Just how horrendously fallible were these people who wrote these precepts, that are credited to your so-called "loving God"? I certainly hoped for better. I still puzzle today how God could cause a woman to have her hand cut off for grasping a man by the genitals in a fight. Yet Deut. 25:11 seems to disagree with this. I wonder how a God could possibly force a woman to marry her rapist, yet Deut 22:28-29 seem to teach this as well. While I am all for the teachings of Christ in the Sermon on the Mount, to some extent, I am questioning it all, there is apparently no validity to anything in your Bible. I would probably get along better with the instructions of the Abolition of Man, by C.S. Lewis.
Don't you find it sad that your "God" couldn't cause any better inspiration for His "alleged" word than this?
:-( I certainly wish He had, because some of the wonderful Christians that I know seem to believe that He is, but apparently, it's not as I suspected. Who really knows if there is a God anyway, or if it is not all pointless.
John Smith
Hello!
You bring up some good points. Maybe it is time for the teachings of other great religions of the world to be put together in a new eclectic Bible. What if there were no Bible, no religion, would the world be a better place? We certainly could do without the inquisitions. Should we throwaway all the knowledge of the past to build a new society, or use the past as a foundation on which to build a new future?
When I was in Bible College (a very conservative one) I learned about “progressive revelation” (even thought they reject progressive creation). New revelation superceded the old revelation. Paul in his New Testament writings taught that Christians were not under the laws of the Old Testament. Some of the problem with the verses you list is our lack of understanding of what they meant back then. Many are clearly based on cultural differences that we no longer observe today. The key is the basic principles that are taught, not the cultural idiosyncrasies. Too many denominations and cults are caught up in these idiosyncrasies.
If the Sermon on the Mount is all that you accept, then start there and build on that. I do wish that the Bible were easier to understand. Learning Hebrew and Greek was not easy for me, but don’t throw the baby out with the bath water. There are many problems in the Bible, but there are also many great pearls.
Even if there is no God, life is far better believing in a God of hope than in a world with no hope. We hope against hope as Abraham did to arrive at true faith.
Sincerely,
Stephen C. Meyers, Th. D
Hi again Dr. Meyers,
Well, I guess there is nothing true about the Bible. How can you believe in something that is not true? I find that a bit detestable, unless perhaps it was a Dostoyevskian Ethic or something. But still, that's sad.
So the Resurrection is bogus? And we obviously weren't created in the image of God, or anything of that nature. And I suppose this "Jesus" that people are supposed to be worshipping, and believing in for salvation, really is just another great teacher that died long ago?
What about the Christian Gospel? Is that worthless as well? I suppose all of the evangelicals in the world will have to stop preaching lies to people, because they see right through them anyway. Then eventually Christianity will either evolve or die off probably. And that'll be that, because if Jesus is dead, then there is no second coming, and if there is no second coming, then who needs to believe in him anyway?
I suppose I could fake believing in something like that for my fiancee, but I don't know if that would be entirely honest. Why teach your kids a lie? It may be a good fairy tale, but who needs fairy tales anyway?
I would like very much to get that creation text from Hagigah 11-14 from you if that is possible. Thanks for offering.
John Smith
Hello!
I have a web page that talks about legalism (http://bibleandscience.com/murray.htm#legalism). One of its traps is an all or nothing line of thinking. The Bible must be all true. If there is one slight error in science or history, all of it must be thrown out. II Timothy 3:16 teaches that the Bible is inspired by God for instruction in righteousness. The Bible is not supposed to be a science book, or a history book, but a spiritual book with spiritual lessons for instruction in righteousness.
A parable is a fairy tale with a spiritual lesson. Must the parable be scientifically and historically true to teach righteousness? Do not throw the whole Bible out because it does not meet your definition of what scripture should be (completely scientifically accurate). Poetry or parables are not meant to be scientific statements of truth.
If the Bible must be all or nothing, then you might as well get rid of it now, but you will not find any other book that matches it in spiritual truth and righteousness.
Sincerely,
Stephen C. Meyers, Th.D.
Institute for Biblical & Scientific Studies